January 13, 2005

  • TOPIC: THE CASE FOR ISRAEL


    This was originally just going to be a response in the last post, which has received some good comments, but it’s long, so I’ll put it here:


    I’ve begun to have some interesting discussions w/ my roommate.  He just finished reading “The Case For Isreal,” by Alan Dershowitz.  Like myself, we’re both Jewish, and grew up thinking Israel = good, Arabs = bad.  For the most part, I still hold that position. (the same way I held the position US = good only a few months ago).  When I think of Israel, I think:


    a) after WWII, the Jews needed a home, otherwise we’d all be dead


    b) once Israel became a state in ’48, they were continuously attacked by Arabs.  Any land they won in defensive wars is their land, and in fact, there is no other country in the world that we’d expect to give back land won in a defensive war


    c) the Arabs have continuously turned down peace, and are only interested in destroying all Jews


    d) Israel, like America, gives its citizens so many freedoms and rights that could never be dreamed of in any Arab country.  Israel’s military actions are moral compared to Arab terrorists who go after innocent people.  Israel’s military actions are in self-defense, while Arab terrorists seek to exterminate all of Jewish Israel


    those are the basic ideas in my head…Dershowitz goes through a list of 32 frequent criticism of Israel, and obviously has a defense for every one.  It was interesting that I had just read Chomsky’s “What Uncle Sam Really Wants,” and had no idea that the book my friend was reading addresses Chomsky on page one as “far left,” and throughout the book as a supporter of anti-semitism.  We agreed to swap books, and I think we’ve both fallen into the trap of becoming partisans, (my friend wanted to burn my Chomsky book before opening a page after reading what an anti-Semite he was), and I’m already more of a skeptic of Dershowitz than I have been of Zinn or Chomsky (although years ago I read some Dershowitz w/ an open mind about civil liberties or something).  Anyways…what I immediately did was read Dershowitz’ criticisms of Chomsky, specifically what my friend had read to me about Chomsky’s support for Robert Faurisson, a Holocaust denier.  After hearing 2-pages, I was left thinking, “oh my god, how could Chomsky do such a thing.”  Dershowitz mentioned how Chomsky not only supported Faurisson’s free speech, but provided a forward for Faurisson’s book, thereby “joining with the author, and defending the substance of Faurisson’s work.”


    After reviewing the Chomsky-Faurisson case in further detail, it became quickly evident how Dershowitz, a clever lawyer, was able to sell to the jury (the unknowing and impressionable reader), that Chomsky was anti-Semetic, or at least had a few screws loose, and was “disqualified from ever being taken seriously on matters pertaining to Jews.”


    First of all, Chomsky has written without equivocation that the Holocaust was one of the sickest crimes committed against humanity.  To try to allude, as Dershowitz does, that Chomsky either believes the arguments of Holocaust deniers, or that he defends the “substance” of their work, is a flat out lie, or at least, false in logic.  The truth is, Chomsky is one of the staunchest defenders of civil liberties and the freedom of speech.  Chomsky’s support for Faurisson went no further than his support for his freedom to say something, even something as wrong and offensive as denying the Holocaust.  If we begin to ban speech, even the most wrong and controversial, we run a slippery slope with the possible banning of things that are right and controversial (for example, some Mississippi libraries are trying to ban Jon Stewart’s book, “America.”)


    With that being said, Chomsky wrote a letter on behalf of Faurisson, and said he could use it for any purpose.  When Faurisson used it as a forward to his book discrediting the Holocaust, people falsely concluded that Chomsky was giving his stamp of approval to the legitimacy of the content, not simply the legitimacy of the right to free speech.  Upon realizing this, Chomsky called for his letter to be taken out of the book, but realized it was too late, and in fact regreted that he asked for this.  He had done nothing wrong, it was merely a case of his words being taken out of context, something that Dershowitz does in his book as well.


    Later in the same chapter, Dershowitz shows how radical imams who preach hatred of Jews often cite historians like Faurisson.  Here, Dershowitz commits a double-fallacy.  First, he’s already made a false link between Chomsky and a Holocaust denier, and he attempts to extend it to a radical-imam who wants to destroy the Jews.  Second, he ignores the fact that Chomsky has a very strict definition of “anti-Semitism” (he is a linguistics scholar after all).  If you say you hate Israel, you’re an anti-Zionist, if you say you hate Jews, you’re an anti-Semite.  With that definition he holds that Faurisson is an anti-Zionist, because he denounces “Zionist lies,” however, this does not make him an anti-Semite.  In Dershowitz’ attempt to draw a link between Chomsky and Sheikh Ibrahim Madhi, who preaches hatred of Jews and blames Jews for the Holocaust, Dershowitz writes, ”Chomsky would not regard him as anti-Semitic”  Not only is that unsupported, but it’s not true.  Chomsky WOULD consider him to be anti-Semitic. 


    Dershowitz does a very good job of misstating Chomsky’s views, in order to show that people, even someone as well-respected as Chomsky, who are critical of the state of Isreal, are also anti-Semitic. 


    The real issue, is the question of, “is it anti-Semetic to single out Isreal” as Chomsky did when calling for colleges such as Harvard to devest their endowment money from Israel.  Of all the countries to single out, why would someone single out Israel, unless they were anti-Semetic?  “The intellectual godfather of this campaign is none other than Noam Chomsky, who has called for the abolition of the state of Israel and teh substitution of a ‘secular binational state.’


    Well…first of all, I don’t know all of Chomsky’s views, but I doubt they’re based on “ignorance, bigotry, and cynicism,” as Dershowitz suggests.  The question is, what would possess Chomsky, a Jew himself, and so many others who believe in truth, freedom, and equality, to single out Israel over other countries for divestment?


    As I reverse the picture, I begin to ask myself this question: Why does the US give so much support to Israel, over other countries for investment?  I’m not sure if schools give disproportionate amount of funds to Israel, but I’m certain we give more military aid to Israel than any other nation.  My recent discoveries of US history show me that when the US gives aid, it tends to be to aid our corporations to get rich, while ensuring that the democracy we support is a democracy that is willing to oppress its own people. 


    However, Israel is clearly a double-edged sword, because it is viewed as the homeland of the Jews.  Yes…it was 5 years ago now that I just returned from a 10-day “birthright Isreal trip,” an all expense paid trip paid for by two very rich and gernerous millionaires, who wanted to help Jewish people, mostly college students, who had never been on an organized trip to Israel, to get back in touch with their culture. 


    So…unlike US actions in Central and South America to overthrow certain democracies and support others, which was supported purely by corporate greed (see post below), support for Israel comes from Jews as well, and for the primary and legitimate reason of wanting a safe Jewish homeland after nearly being exterminated in WWII (and the anti-Semitism that has existed for centuries before that). 


    However, my new rule is to look for the Trojan Horse from politicians.  Seeing that it’s the Republican party and radical-rights that support Israel, I think they’ve created a smoke screen to support a legitimate cause with Jewish backing, to cover-up for the corporate cause, of strategic economic and political positioning in the oil-rich Middle East.

Comments (9)

  • If I oppose Israel’s apartheid that makes me neither “anti-Semitic” nor “anti-Zionist.” Just as opposing South Africa’s apartheid didn’t make me “anti-Dutch,” “anti-White,” or “anti-South African.” Dershowitz is an attorney legendary for demonizing those that argue with him. That’s a political tactic, not an instrument of learning or logic.

    Why “single out Israel”? That phrase alone is nonsense. Who is singling out Israel? Oh, typically the same people who fought against investment in white-rule South Africa, fought against US support for the Contras, have argued for a tougher US-line on Tibetan freedom, supported Bosnian self-rule, all the way back to those who favored Biafran rights to self-determination. There’s no “singling out,” but Israel is “our baby,” essentially a US colony in terms of economics/military/foreign policy. The Brits were deeply concerned with “Rhodesia” in the late 60s and 70s because it was “theirs.” Israel is “ours.”

    Despite the concerns of Israel’s “appearance” in the midst of someone else’s country (If the Cherokee insisted on taking Georgia back those right-wing “Christians” would feel differently about “return”), I have no huge problem with the nation’s existence. My issue with Israel is the apartheid issue. If they are a legitimate nation, surely if they want to claim to be “a democracy,” than all adults who live there (born there?) deserve equal rights. If all that land is Israel, than all those people are voting, equal citizens of Israel. If those people are not Israelis, then, obviously, the land they live on is not Israel. “Israelophiles” want it both ways, arguing in almost exactly the same terms, for the “native homeland” policy so reviled in South Africa.

    There is only one legitimate way to solve this. Creation of the Palestinian State that has never had a chance to exist. And because anything else will create eternal war, Israel can choose one of two “legitimate” borders: the pre-1967 “Green Line” because the Palestinians have clearly indicated that they will accept that, or, the only truly internationally recognized border, the 1948 UN partition line.

    As far as “legitimate ways to fight a war,” the US has been in the absolute forefront, from Vicksburg and Atlanta, to Hiroshima, to Abu Ghraib, of saying “there are no rules.” People fight with what they have. The Israelis have tanks and jets, the Palestinians have rocks and suicide bombers. How exactly is the killing of Israeli civilians any more morally repugnant than the firebombing of Tokyo in WWII?

  • “You have an odd idea of stealing thenarrator

    Perhaps in the future, you can take the time to read to whom that portion of the comment is directed to.

    I have a lot of issues with gov’t subsidies.  They’re bad for the world economy, and they’re worse for our economy.  Not to mention they reek of corruption and cronyism.  Aside from the Libertarians, though, I have yet to see a party run on the platform of abolishing them entirely.  I do not dispute, however, that the US, the nation, as a player in global market, has a right to institute such subsidies, any more than I would deny OPEC has a right to create an oil cartel.  Sure, OPEC is shooting both their own and our economies in the foot.  That’s besides the point.  Countries are sovereign entities.  How is the US subsidy any different than the US just refusing to buy cotton from Africa?

    Chomsky willfully distorts the truth for his own ends.  He would have you believe that the US is Nazi Germany (not just like the Nazis, or have Nazi tendancies, which would be bad enough).  We took the this role to battle the anti-facism force the USSR represented.  You know, that country that wilfully killed 25 million+ people. 

    Put simply, once this trope has been accepted, the moral fetters fall away, and one is not merely justified, but enjoined to commit acts which would otherwise be of the most appalling possible nature. For if one is facing Nazi Germany, if you are the citizen of a state so permeated with industrial evil, then one has no choice but to destroy that society by any means at your command.

    This lie is nothing less than the hinge upon which Chomsky’s entire career turns, it is the one thing which justifies everything else: the denials of genocide, the apologetics for totalitarianism, the anti-American propaganda, the breezy dismissal of the most horrendous forms of human suffering, the lies upon lies upon lies; all of it can be justified as part of that glorious anti-fascist crusade that exists only in Chomsky’s imagination. His entire conceptualization of the world, and with it the whole glorious edifice of the Chomskyite reputation, that unquantifiable thrill of worship, of being a guru to the fashionably disaffected, is threatened by the loss of the initial lie, and thus, the lie must be maintained, for without it, the emperor would not only be revealed as naked, but as a villain as well, and the accumulated intellectual atrocities of a lifetime might, at long last, have to be answered for; an eventuality Chomsky no doubt, and quite understandably, considering the breadth and variety of those atrocities, and the raw human cost they have accrued, devoutly wishes to avoid.

  • thatliberalmedia:

    Chomsky willfully distorts the truth for his own ends.  He would have you believe that the US is Nazi Germany (not just like the Nazis, or have Nazi tendancies, which would be bad enough).  We took the this role to battle the anti-facism force the USSR represented.  You know, that country that wilfully killed 25 million+ people.”

    To claim that we opposed the USSR because of fascism, just doesn’t hold true.  The argument collapses when you see our support for fascist leaders in Central and South America, including watching over practices that were truly gruesome and in some ways comparable to Nazi death camps.  Brutal military actions all in the name of keeping the poor, poor, and instilling a gov’t that would open up its borders for American corporations.  It is simply not consistent to argue that the Cold War was a war against fascism.

    I suggest reading Chomsky’s book “profits over people,” to get a more accurate understanding of Chomsky.  You will see that he does not deny genocide or support totalitarianism.  He is as outspoken against the atrocities of Stalin and Hitler as anyone. 

  • forcible taking of property = stealing
    forcing people to give you what is theirs through threat or intimidation = stealing
    bilking people out of what is their via exploitative methods = stealing
    I know you don’t agree thatliberalmedia, but most of the planet would recognize these definitions.

  • I think you and thenarrator are right on…I’d just add that the Palestinians have rocks and suicide bombers, the Israelis have tanks and jets WHICH ARE SUBSIDISED BY THE U.S. For whatever bizarre reason, nobody is supposed to ever even question the policies of the Israeli government. t’s happening at my school…a professor is being defamed by the David Project for holding an opinion which is critical of Israel (Details if you want them.)

    Chomsky is a hero of mine, primarily for his work in linguistics which is the field I hope to enter. Anyway, about your comment, I’ve never had streaming video on my page and I have no idea how to do it. Sorry!

  • That’s a fascinating article dharmabums. The right has begun a concerted national campaign to silence university faculty, led by students who don’t want to be “harassed” with views not duplicating those they’ve heard in their family’s dining room and on FoxNews. This too is an old Facist tactic. I noted in the article that those leading the complaints have never had relevant classes (making them second-hand liars), and the one “on-record” incident that anyone even claims occurred, didn’t happen in a class or on campus.

  • I’m neither anti-Israel nor anti-Palestinian. I’m anti the denial of equal citizenship to those born within the territory Israel “controls.” Palestinians, though, will probably keep fighting the fight for political rights that they began with Lawrence of Arabia, until of course, they achieve self-determination and a reasonable share of the land of Palestine/Israel. After all, in 1947 the Israelis were terrorists, because they didn’t have a nation. (Just ask the British Army)

    But the argument is almost always framed in the way designed to most inflame passions. So, as you’ve pointed out, Israel’s Jewish defenders always claim that any opposition to Israel or its policies equals anti-Semitism. Israel’s Christian-right defenders claim that opposition to Israel is anti-Biblical. Of course Palestinians are viewed by one side as “Freedom Fighters” (heroic), or “Terrorists” (pure evil). And the obvious questions are never asked: If “Palestine” is not created than are Palestinians denied civil rights for all time? Would Palestinians absolutely accept a nation consisting on the West Bank and Gaza as they existed pre-1967? In a two-state solution what are the guarantees of minority rights within both countries? (trying to avoid another refugee flood)

    and the obvious one: Why would the Palestinians stop fighting before they’ve gotten the nation they deserve? The pre-Israelis were murdering British soldiers up to the day they declared independence. Why wouldn’t Palestinians do the same?

  • thanarrator: you’re exactly right. And it is actually questionable whether the one “on-record” incident ever occurred, as Dr. Massad says he’s never even met the student making the claim. Dr. Massad posted a reply on his webpage…it’s here if you’re interested.

    I’m not anti-Palestinian nor anti-Israel either. I suppose I generally come off as more pro-Palestinian because everything in the media and in US policy is so consistently pro-Israel. I’m obviously not in favor of suicide bombings or violence of any sort…I’m not someone who subscribes to the cause and effect argument that people can only be systematically oppressed for so long before fighting back. I understand it, but I don’t support violence. That being said, what I find more disturbing than anything is our unwaivering support of Israel as they violate the Palestinian’s human rights on a daily basis. The demolition of homes and businesses, the arrest and detainment (and according to Amnesty International, torture) of Palestinians for years without due process, etc. The human rights abuses that we are funding are unacceptable. We can’t seriously ask for peace while we’re endorsing such abuse.

  • A lot of people fail to realize the role Zionist terrorism played in creating Israel.  I’m glad someone brought it up.  I was once arguing with a conservative Texan about this subject and tried to use the following analogy.  I asked him if the UN said that all American landowners had to give their land back to the Indians, would he cheerfully comply as he thinks the Palestinians should?  Unfortunately he still didn’t get the point.

    A good site I found on the whole topic is “Palestine:  Information with Provenance,” at

    http://student.cs.ucc.ie/cs1064/jabowen/IPSC/php/home.php

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